have remembered one of the things that i wanted to post about, and it's not meaningful after all. au contraire, it was supposed to be a fluffy, perhaps humorous, piece, after all the whining that my latest posts have been, but the content would still be related to those posts. speaking of which, i have to edit those posts so that they're somewhat more coherent and understandable. this was sparked by a discussion i had with a friend regarding the Oct. 21, 2002 post on non-policy debaters going out with policy folks.
from the 10.21.02 entry:
don't think that it'd work out to go out with someone who's not a policy debater, though, just because policy debate is so time-consuming and such an obsession...non-policy people have a hard time understanding why their SOs [significant others] are spending hours and hours cutting files or weeks at camps or consecutive weekends out of town for tournaments. when it comes to debate and SOs...the SO loses out. which is as it should be...;-)
friend's comment:
i think more people would understand your putting debate over an SO than you might expect. you'd just have to find a person who can understand obsessions that take precedence over everything. being one of those people...i'm not really in a position to judge how many people are like that, though.
many people have obsessions, but policy debate constitutes a unique subculture in itself. It's a realm with its own discourse, its own practices, and it's based around an intense activity and to some extent it's an extremely elitist world. If you don't understand what's going on, you're shut out. It may not be intentional, but if a person doesn't comprehend what's happening or the basic parts of the policy world (resolution, case, 2NR, 2AR, kritik, disad, conditionality good, etc.), then s/he will be lost, both during the rounds and during the rest of the time. because unlike LDers and speechies, policy people talk about policy during their free time. I've heard this from speechies and LDers and witnessed it myself - at stanford during the speech camp i had lunch now and then with a table full of IErs and the discussions never once touched on speech-related subjects. whereas at debate camp, policy always came up -- arguing about the resolution, about cases, about rounds, and discussion of stuff related to the policy world, such as who's going to be the top competition this year on the circuit and old war stories. this was during lunch, at night in the dorms, while walking from lab to lunch or lecture, or while calling friends while at debate camp. and it happened all the camps i've been to - stanford, kentucky, stanford, and UT.
furthermore, like any other subculture, policy has its own practices. Spreading is a case in point. To anyone who's not a policy person (and to many who are), spreading is incomprehensible, stupid, and the opposite of what 'debate should be about' (which i take to mean eloquence, oratory, and rhetoric.). for policy - it's not necessary, prolly, but it definitely makes debates much more vigorous, fast-paced, demanding, and exciting. i've done slow debates before, unfortunately, and i hated the experience. it's frustrating, the critical analysis and refutation of arguments isn't there, and it's more about presentation than in-depth argumentation and ripping people to shreds (or being ripped to shreds) on issues. if you want debate that's oratorical and more like public speaking, go do Parli or LD or Congress or JSA. there are already forums for rhetoric-based debates, and thank goodness policy isn't always one of them. policy rounds can be displays of extravagant locution, as opposed to actual on-point debate - local tournaments, league tournaments, and the finals of Emory fall into this category, and from what i've heard, UIL tournaments do as well (if my take on UIL is incorrect, please tell me.) - and when they are, it's frustrating and horrible.
hence, because of the nature of policy as being this subculture that's largely impenetrable to outsiders, it's hard for a non-policy debater to go out with a policy debater. furthermore, people are selfish, and they want attention to be paid to them. Unfortunately, policy takes up an enormous amount of time, just for tournaments, practice rounds, cutting files, and sheer work, and it's hard for non-policy people to see why their SOs are spending so much time with tubs, files, and debate partners. never having gone out with anyone, i wouldn't be able to speak with experience, but based on observations of my school's team, policy seems to take up as much time as an SO (again, please correct me if i'm wrong.).
to provide examples of what exactly it's like to go out with policy folks, i wrote the following conversations. yes, they're not real, in that i didn't cut-and-paste the text from an IM box or a transcript of listening to debaters and their SOs; however, they're based on conversations between policy debaters and their SOs.
Conversation #1, a policy debater and his/her significant other Try To Make A Date
this one is heavily based on real conversations that i've been privy to.
SO: so, what're you doing next weekend?
debater: eh, i'm at berkeley...
SO: oh. a tournament?
debater: yeah!
SO: didn't you have one last weekend?
debater: yep. berkeley's gonna be so awesome, though...it's 8 prelim rounds, not just 6!
SO: um...you do realize what's next weekend?
debater: the Cal tournament. didn't i just tell you that?
SO: no...
debater: then what is it?
SO: OUR FUCKING HALF-YEAR ANNIVERSARY!!!
SO: AND MY 16TH BIRTHDAY!!!
debater: oh...oops. well, happy birthday! i'll try to call you or something at night after the tournament on saturday, then, k?
SO: ...
SO: ... you said we'd go do something special on my birthday...
debater: ::shrugs philosophically:: eh...i'm really, really sorry...look, i'll make it up to you somehow, k?
SO: you said that last weekend when you cancelled our date for the stanford tournament. and when you cancelled our four-month anniversary for the emory tournament, and all those other times to do practice rounds, and to cut files...
debater: well, i really, really mean it this time...i honestly didn't mean for stuff to keep coming up...
SO: and then we were supposed to spend New Year's together but you said that you couldn't take the time off because you had to prep for MBA...
SO: YOU SPEND MORE TIME WITH YOUR FRICKIN DEBATE TUBS AND YOUR STUPID FILES THAN YOU DO WITH ME, DAMN IT!!!
::SO storms off, leaving debater looking puzzled. debater shrugs and walks back to cut some more files::
#2
this is an actual quote, more or less.
debater: oh...the coffee house on saturday night? Yeah, i guess i can go if i do really badly and don't make it to elims at the tournament this weekend, but hopefully i'll break to elims and i'll be debating the whole weekend long!!! i'll let you know what's happening like...7 p.m. saturday night, k?
^-- that did not make the girlfriend too happy, to state the obvious (and yes, that was a real line that someone said to his SO).
#3
a commonly heard line. 'cathhhhh s/he's spending more time with his/her debate tubs than s/he is with me! s/he loves debate more than s/he loves me! ::hysterical sobbing::' line that i've heard from random SOs of debaters. @.@ case in point - SOs don't understand how debaters spend so much time with their tubs.
policy/nonpolicy matches are hard on the debater, as well, because part of the pleasures of going out with someone are, i'm assuming, being able to talk to them (unless you're in it purely for the sex and the snogs). not being able to talk about debate because it requires an enormous amount of explanation and you have to have done it to truly understand it, is horrible. one thing that i hate about coming back from camps or tournaments is that there's NO ONE around to talk to about debate - no one to vent to about how illegit and interventionist that last decision at st. mark's was, no one to argue with about the merits of MHCT versus holism, no one to bounce ideas for answers to krishna off of, no one to drool over the kothari '93 card with. especially that last one - show a good K card to a non-policy person, and aside from the fact that most of them won't understand why the card has 'orgasmic' and eight stars next to it in the margins, they'll stare and ask a) what the hell is 'coalition-based antipolitical antihistorical'; b) why are you reading weirdo stuff like this?
something else just occurred to me - debate partners spend a LOT of time with each other, when you count the tournaments, the camps, the practice rounds, etc. so potentially an SO could get jealous of the policy person's partner - something along the line of, say,
SO: Bob...you're spending an awful lot of time with Sally, lately.
Bob: Sally's my debate partner and we have a tournament this weekend.
SO: you're spending a lot of time with him, possibly more than you are with me...
Bob: ::rolls eyes:: look, there's NOTHING between me and Sally, ok? Sheesh, you're so paranoid!
or
SO: how come sally gets so much more of your time than i do?? ::wails::
Bob: cuz he's my debate partner and we have a tournament this weekend...
these are only my views on debaters/nondebaters going out; if you're a policy person and you have a perfectly functional relationship with someone who has not, at any time, ever had any contact with the policy/speech/LD world outside of you, props to you (and tell me how you manage it). these views are based on a) mi understanding of people; b) hours and hours of listening to the non-policy SOs and ex-SOs of policy debaters rant about their dysfunctional relationships. They are only my views, and feel free to disagree or agree with them and to express your opinions to me (that's why there are nice links at the top of the page for emailing and IMing me), but please NO FLAMES - attack the ideas expressed herein, not the author.